17 replies to this topic

[Sdw]

First of all, let me say that I have not been following this project that closely until recently
(I own a GP32, and was an active developer back in 2003 or so, but then I never jumped on the GP2X, so I kind of lost touch with the community), so perhaps much of the things I am about to ask has been covered. However, I have not seen this answered in the FAQ.

In essence, my question is - how is this project possible,?

At work I was involved with a project where we developed our own ARM-based hardware, running Linux. Now this was an embedded device aimed at the industrial market, so no screen, no user input etc. Still, I think I have a bit of insight on the amount of work that goes into the development process, with prototype PCBs, case manufacturing, getting drivers up and running under Linux etc. etc.

What I wonder is how the guys behind this are going to (or rather, are in the process of!) pulling this off, both from a financial and development perspective.

Is the project financially backed by some company? VC? Are the members of the dev team working fulltime, or is just a hobby?

I see that you have made good progress in the PCB-department, but then there are such things as casing and assembly, I wonder how far they have gone into this?
I mean you would have to CAD the case, then get some (probably Chinese) firm to manufacture them. Then you have assembly, putting it all together mechanically, considering the rather advanced layout with keyboard, analog buttons etc. I can only imagine this being quite labor-intensive.

What about the Linux low-level stuff, device drivers etc. this stuff can be really hard to get debugged and stable!

Price - the announced price seems like it could barely cover the costs of the parts, considering that for the
first runs you are probably buying components in 1000 (or perhaps even 100?) batches. Then you have startup costs for PCB-manufacturing, startup costs for fabbing the casing etc. But I guess you are calculating with not turning a profit right away?

Finally the timeframe, I have seen summer this year for the first non-prototype batch. This seems way, WAY optimistic! There must be literally THOUSANDS of things left to do, not to mention all testing, not only of software, but also hardware like pure mechanical things (if the user flips open/closes his system 10.000 times, is the LCD ribbon cable still OK for example).

It might sound like I am negative, but this is such a major undertaking that it boggles the mind. I mean, we are talking about a project that is on the same level as a PSP or DS (or PDA) in hardware capability, but instead of having a development team of perhaps hundreds of individuals working for years, you have a four (right?) man team attempting to do the same.
If the guys can pull it off, it will be one of the most amazing displays of commitment ever.

Edited by Sdw, 14 April 2008 - 11:29 AM.

[sehs33]

I don't have all the answers, but what is know is this:
1. The first commercial batch will consist of 3000 units.
2. This is not a four men show, it was mentioned several time that there others beside Craig, Evil Dragon and Mweston, and I don't think you need full time workers for the pre-manufacturing tasks, you can easily outsource things like the case design.
3. It is a true thing that the first adopters will be taking a risk, since there wont be that high level of QA, but I believe that both Craig and ED wont hesitate to help fixing anything that can be fixed for the first batch or at least help by providing directions\replacement parts.
Welcome back Sdw

[Yuglooc]

All I can add is that there is more developers then the four mentioned. As squidge and a few others have mentioned having devkits. How many I do not know, but I'm fairly certain that its more then the four mentioned on the main page. Also, CraigIX spoke of how he sent the pandora paper mockup to his "Financial Supporters" (Not the word he used, can't really recall the word that was used). So yes, I guess there is Financial backup

[Pickle]

Also Mweston has shown videos of other devices that seem to suggest Pandora isnt the first.
There are some that are working for free and for the fun of it.
Plus i think there is good support from the TI side of things.

[cappuchok]

Besides the already stated fact that there are more than the four "known" developers working on the device, and an unknown number of high-profile (in the community) developers porting stuff already, I do believe Texas Instruments have a vested interest in supporting the team in substantial ways, considering that this will be something of a flagship to show off the power of their high-end OMAP3 architecture (to my knowledge, the Pandora will be the first publicly available device to use the OMAP3 chip, and certainly the first to use the highest-end model of the line).

In short, I believe the team will be able to pull it off (and I'll be ordering one of the 3000 batch for sure), but like many others I'd appreciate more frequent updates to the blog (along the lines of a developer diary).

Edited by cappuchok, 14 April 2008 - 01:38 PM.

[Flaming_Trashcan]

(and I'll be ordering one of the 3000 batch for sure), but like many others I'd appreciate more frequent updates to the blog (along the lines of a developer diary).

+1

On topic, it seems unbelievable to my small-town mind too, but I'm just biding my time and holding out hope and I have a feeling the result will be stunning.

[Karel Jansens]

In essence, my question is - how is this project possible,?

I cut a lot of stuff, so I could give the concise answer:

Who cares?

If it works, great. If it doesn't, there's no skin off my back. And unless you're a secret investor, why do you care if it's possible or not? Just wait and see.

[craigix]

You could really ask first how did GPH pull off the GP2X? There were only 6 of them and it only took them ~8 months. Of course these things are a lot easier in Korea as their country is geared up for manufacturing these sorts of things.

The Pandora Project has been runnning for almost 1 and a half years.

Case manufacture has been on going for quite some time and we hope to have some semi-final cases rapid prototyped very soon with the hinges, LCD & ribbon all inside and working.

It's just a situation of little by little we are working towards the final system. If any bugs crop up we just work though them, we have always said we will never release the system until we are happy with it even if it means putting back the release date.

As people have pointed out we have hardware out there and our own PCBs are working some of which are going to be making their way to devs in the coming week.

Also I'm in the process of writing 'The story so far' for all of you who want to read it

[Pickle]

Also I'm in the process of writing 'The story so far' for all of you who want to read it

Will it be on the blog when your done?

[Shiny]

If it works, great. If it doesn't, there's no skin off my back. And unless you're a secret investor, why do you care if it's possible or not? Just wait and see.

Anyone interested in owning a pandora cares. If this project doesn't succeed, potential customers will be at a loss because there is no other product on the market that I am aware of that offers the same experience and power for such a low price.

[craigix]

Also I'm in the process of writing 'The story so far' for all of you who want to read it

Will it be on the blog when your done?

Yes

[atomicthumbs]

It's possible because the Pandora team is just a set of AIs running on a quantum computer.

Edit:

awesome AIs

Edited by atomicthumbs, 14 April 2008 - 03:41 PM.

[Karel Jansens]

If it works, great. If it doesn't, there's no skin off my back. And unless you're a secret investor, why do you care if it's possible or not? Just wait and see.

Anyone interested in owning a pandora cares. If this project doesn't succeed, potential customers will be at a loss because there is no other product on the market that I am aware of that offers the same experience and power for such a low price.

Yeah, so? It's a games computer/UMPC, not the Second Coming, for frak's sake. If it never surfaces (which won't happen, because these are kewl dudes) just cry a little and move on.

I really don't see the point of your post.

Other than trolling and trying to spread some FUD, that is...

[AireTamStorm]

In essence, my question is - how is this project possible,?

Believe it or not, there is a demand out there for an up-to-date, powerful, multimedia rich, WiFi capable, small, touchscreen, keyboard packing, gaming oriented, kick-ass Linux palmtop out there.

Me? Give me a terminal, WiFi, and htop. I'm happy.

I sure as hell thought I was waiting for Android to get my hands on a usable mobile terminal

[trooper]

If it works, great. If it doesn't, there's no skin off my back. And unless you're a secret investor, why do you care if it's possible or not? Just wait and see.

Anyone interested in owning a pandora cares. If this project doesn't succeed, potential customers will be at a loss because there is no other product on the market that I am aware of that offers the same experience and power for such a low price.

Yeah, so? It's a games computer/UMPC, not the Second Coming, for frak's sake. If it never surfaces (which won't happen, because these are kewl dudes) just cry a little and move on.

I really don't see the point of your post.

Other than trolling and trying to spread some FUD, that is...

The thing is, This is billed as the unofficial successor to the GP line of handhelds, As there appears to be no official information coming GPH of an official successor. There is really no other candidate for this position considering the amount of community input that was put forward from members here that actually shaped the device (pandora) into it`s current form. Which makes the pandora more of a personal thing, Rather than just some bog standard off the shelf, Cobbled together lump of eletronics. That in my eyes, Makes the pandora unique.

Trooper