[Chip]

Asmo, on 05 January 2010 - 01:44 PM, said:

So 6 weeks from now is the current best case scenario before the possibility of the 'Green light'?

No, there have already been two revisions.

Best case scenario for a green light is tomorrow. The faults in the current cases were relayed to the factory when they were received two weeks ago. The next revision may well have already been made and is on it's way for inspection. It could show up tomorrow, be perfect, and the green light could be given.

Worst case is never. The new models might not show up for several weeks. There could be some problem at the factory. Maybe the factory workers are particularly thick and it takes ten more revisions. Maybe they damaged one of the molds and have to re-cut it. Maybe the workers come down with flying pig flu (a horrible combination of bird flu and swine flu) and have to spend a month in bed. Maybe meteor demolished the entire building. Having already paid for cases that will never be produced, the entire project could collapse.

You could make a guess at anything in between those scenarios, but it would just be a guess. The factory is aware of the issues and they're working on them now, if they haven't fixed them already (or been flattened by a space rock). The new cases will get here when they get here, unless they don't. The harder you press for a shipping date, the more likely you are to get an inaccurate one. The shipping timeframe is, as it has always been, "When it's ready". It is impossible to be more accurate than that.

[Asmo]

OK I better understand all the terrifying weekage laid out there. ;)

Chip, on 05 January 2010 - 08:04 PM, said:

The shipping timeframe is, as it has always been, "When it's ready".

Don't even go there. I'm biting my lip so hard there'll be teeth marks on my chin.

[Peri27]

Well as I said, nothing until May.

I thought so.....,much boom and still has months.

People started to backpedal logically ....

[calc84maniac]

Peri27, on 05 January 2010 - 02:13 PM, said:

Well as I said, nothing until May.

I thought so.....,much boom and still has months.

People started to backpedal logically ....

[jumpman]

You know, I think a lot of the hate and anger could be cured with a simple daily update from any team member! I'm not talking about releasing trade secrets or how many trips to the crapper anyone has taken, just a little post like "Spoke to the factory today, and problem a, b, and c where fixed, but they are still working on problem d, should know more within a few days". Now when the few days arrive, and you havn't heard anything, guess what, say you havn't heard anything.

Last week was just terrible in reagrds to forum info & updates. Everyone thought another "final case 2" was on the way, and arriving thursday, only to find out that those cases where out of date, and couldn't be used to green light mass production. Someone should have said that earlier in the week, so guys and gals aren't hoping for something that team members know is impossible, that is just wrong!

Now I know team members are super busy, but it couldn't hurt to give a daily post about what is happening in regards to pandora's shipping to end users at this point. I really can't see any reasons for not keeping more users in the loop in regards to 12+ months of holding ones money! That just seems wrong to me, and that is the only real problem I personally have at this point.


Chris

[DroneB Dev]

fusion_power, on 05 January 2010 - 12:14 PM, said:

I really wonder, why some processes can't be accelerated. The Cinese Factory guys have EYES so they can SEE the faults of thecase. They don't have to send the stuff to MWeston because they should know that these parts never get the green light. So the whole and endless waiting process could be shortened if the Factory simply produces the Cases untill they think, it looks perfect, then they can ship and wait for MWestons comment.
Nobnody can tell me, that they didn't noticed all the problems onto the first Cases. Did they really think, this "quality" would be accepted?
And why all about this "shrinking"? Keep the Case-Parts long enough into the moulds untill they are cooled, then they can't shrink anymore. ;)

OMG, you really dont understand the mould injection process.

its not like they dont want to keep it on the mould (well part of the economical problem does since they have to produce at a profitable speed.)
but taking apart that issue, it takes near 100 cycles more or less depending the product. to get the mould tuned up, thats due to the required
optimal temperature on the mould. and if it was recently mould swapped then they need some more to purge completely the old material in order to
remove color stains and discoloration smears.

im mostly sure they are sending out test cases (and maybe even the mp ones will be since chinese profitable margin is so tight) made out of recovered material (milled or in site re-pellet material.) with some cheap color master to keep the color. really Big Boss doesnt like to dump X ammount of material bags to the dumpster or to be recycled just to make a test. (got yelled at when a boss found out they needed only virgin material to test a straw machine lost near 600Kg of virgin material).

also the product on near start and near end of the mp process will be always different from each other, because the mould can heat up and cooling times need more, or if they over cool, the BackPressure might fail and clog the plastinating point or deform the piece.
EDIT:(btw if youre wondering why i know this, well im a translator for injecting machines like chen-de(china) and Asian Plastic(taiwan/US)

This post has been edited by DroneB Dev: 05 January 2010 - 07:34 PM

[Jaguar]

http://picardfacepal...epper=4&salt=5, im sorry i cant recall how to post this pic, but if anyone can do it, I will aprreciate it. it was used here a while back, but the pic is aabsolutley appropriate for nwo, thanks.

[fischju2000]

Jaguar, on 05 January 2010 - 02:36 PM, said:

http://picardfacepal...epper=4&salt=5, im sorry i cant recall how to post this pic, but if anyone can do it, I will aprreciate it. it was used here a while back, but the pic is aabsolutley appropriate for nwo, thanks.

I will, but just because your post requires a facepalm.

[emil10001]

EvilDragon, on 05 January 2010 - 01:32 PM, said:

If the case would need 8 revisions which all do take 2 weeks, it takes 16 weeks (that's four months!)
If the case is fine after the 3rd revision, that's only 6 weeks (1,5 months).

It all depends on that, so a realistic assumption can only be made once this is all done and the mass production is all there's left :)

At what point would it make sense to either have them start shipping cases overnight or send MWeston over there until they finish? I realize that this could cost a couple thousand dollars, but at some point soon you need to get this finalized, and you're wasting a lot of time with slow shipping between China and Canada.

I think that I can honestly say that if you had a decent competitor, I would really think twice about my preorder. To me it is unacceptable to say that you are just going to go back and forth until forever until it's 'perfect'; especially when there are things that you could be doing to cut down the turnaround time between revs. I think that you are getting to the point where it is the time to put down some extra cash and make it happen. I am getting really sick of this product being 'almost ready' for mass production.

There are things that you, as a company, can do to move things along, please do them.

[Beepo]

EvilDragon, on 05 January 2010 - 06:32 PM, said:

Well, that's hard to tell.
If the case would need 8 revisions which all do take 2 weeks, it takes 16 weeks (that's four months!)
If the case is fine after the 3rd revision, that's only 6 weeks (1,5 months).

It all depends on that, so a realistic assumption can only be made once this is all done and the mass production is all there's left :)

I think that if you told everyone that we're 4 months away on the status page then all the nagging goes away and when it turns up early everyone will be pleasantly surprised :)

EvilDragon, on 05 January 2010 - 06:32 PM, said:

We came from the boards, developed a handheld and therefore had to open up a company.

But we're still just some guys from this community trying to do our best :)

And a fine job you are all doing as well, the only slight problem is managing the expectations of us hungry customers. Happy new year and thank you all for your continued efforts :)

[matzesu]

I hope, the heavy winter in china, and kanada, dont brings a delay: in china is lot of snow yet, and in kanada too (i think, i wasnt there to see it whit my own eyes, but its the norther hemisphere, and it is winter (on the southern hemisphere there must be summer)

but i let surprise me.. :blink:

[fusion_power]

DroneB Dev, on 05 January 2010 - 08:32 PM, said:

OMG, you really dont understand the mould injection process.

I've read some Wikipedia Stuff but of course I don't know much more than the average men from the street. ;)
But I've seen funny Documentations on TV, impressive "Making of Lego-Parts" where the Moulding machines fireing up a lego Brick every 2 seconds or so and I'm talking about the real complicated parts.

But when it is possible (I don't know!) to solve the Shrinking problem just by keeping the part some seconds (!!!) longer into the mould to stabilize the Structure than it would be much better than spending weeks over weeks with trying to solve the problem onto the moulds itself (if this is the source ot the issue). Just my opinion. ^_^

[Jaguar]

My DDay is tomrrow for me. if we get another delay, I will be cancelign my oder, as my nerves are frayed and not much left. ive put my heart and souls into this project, when I preordered, and my spot is somewhere around 2000. but since this thing isnt going to happen, it just as well be 2 million. ok, the oens that dont like the others nagging and being depressed here is you a new target.

[craigix]

Let's try a new way of showing you the situation, we will just copy and paste the emails from the factory:

----

Dear Mr.Michael,

sorry, after i discussed with our technician and we found all of modifications would be finished on Jan.15,2010.

We compared market products with our products last week and we need more EDM working to make the same quality.



I have to inform you and so sorry for delay.



Best regards,



David

----

This will be what we do from now on.

[Beepo]

If you are going down that route can you put them in a read only thread that only OP team can post to please?